Hi,
I'm not suggesting not using a lawyer. However, you had better know your subject well BEFORE you talk to the lawyer, or else the guy will figure he can swindle you and will treat you accordingly.
Hate to be the bearer of bad tidings, but there is a book by an ex-prosecutor on how the law should work and how it actually works. The way it SHOULD work is that your lawyer goes to the law library, examines previous case summaries and precedents like yours, and uses those to argue your case in court.
The way it actually works is that your lawyer goes behind your back to the other guy's lawyer, and they meet for a pow wow with the judge in his chambers. They decide who will win in court, and then your guy argues some gobbledegook in court that has absolutely nothing to do with your case. Of course, they all get their cut.
Sorry,
Christine
----- Original Message -----From: Joseph BeauchampSent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 1:52 PMSubject: Re: [CREI-Alliance] About using a lawyer - was: seeking advise on protecting my down payment
Christine, you hit an important point. Because of your experience, I assume that you spent a lot of time looking into why things went wrong. Out of all my lawyers, I can think of one in OH and a current one in NJ that, indeed, fight like hell for the client and really know their stuff. Most with great reputations seem to spend their efforts marketing and polishing those reputations. When it comes to doing a better job for you by trying X in court or being safe and not touching that pretty rep, well, you know who loses. It is clear to me, and should be obvious to most that even in the personality of the vast majority of lawyers, number one is always them and if you are in second place, well, it is a long way down. It's in their blood.Now, I don't like advising doing it yourself on something extremely important. Many other things, getting started, etc, I go the opposite way -- you screw up an LLC, OK, $50 and start another instead of $1500 to have somebody put something together that could be wrong for you and you never use anyway -- at a time when $1500 means not eating for a year. But, jacking around with a strong $50K when marital property is so tricky and state dependent, I can easily see a "gotcha" that you just didn't happen to read in the law library.. $50K is now shared. [Hmm.. brings to mind a different solution, have the girlfriend borrow $50K so you have shared 50/50 equity... HA!]My advice on something this important is to get recommendations for a lawyer - this is tough and I say get them from multiple places that you trust, because you really don't know until it is too late. Like any profession, the majority go through the motions, can't be sued for incompetence and that is their highest standard of excellence. So, before plunking down cash, make sure you aren't talking to a legal snake oil salesman -- he can fill out the forms -- big whoop.. and there goes your $1K.This doesn't seem like I stress enough KNOWING that you are talking to a valuable "member of your team" as your lawyer and not some bureaucrat out of someone's phonebook.Do you totally dismiss using a lawyer? Can you suggest some modification to that advice from your experience? You bring to mind one brilliant chemist who can be anal, and he studies everything, writes the contract/papers then takes them to his lawyer for approval, etc. His lawyer(s) often ask if they can use what he has elsewhere. But I assume that suggesting such an approach to almost everybody will get you an "Oh sure, whatever". Tain't gonna happen. I sure am not going to do it... well, actually, in one case I do -- my sales agreement. But I live with that daily so I do know what I'm doing inside and out and don't use a lawyer like I should to tweak it (a reminder to me... take sales and rental agreements to Adam to clean up....).Thoughts?-- Joe B.----- Original Message -----From: CM RossSent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 5:15 AMSubject: Re: [CREI-Alliance] seeking advise on protecting my down payment
No, the best bet is to run, not walk to your nearest Law Library at a Law School or Bar Association. Find the laws and case summaries of cases like yours. Jot down the legal terms that you do not understand, and take them to the librarian. He will direct you to books that will explain them to you. It's not hard, just takes a few hours.It can save you thousands of dollars. How would I know? Because if I had done that instead of consulting lawyers, I would have saved myself a lot of time, money, and heartache.Most lawyers are in the habit of telling you what benefits them, not you. Once you demonstrate to them that you know the subject, they are less inclined to try and swindle you.Christine----- Original Message -----From: Judy MooreSent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 5:16 PMSubject: RE: [CREI-Alliance] seeking advise on protecting my down payment
Best bet is to go see a lawyer. I don't know Arizona family law to know if they trace assets after they are co-mingled. In any event, at a minimum, create a contract between the two of you regarding the intent of this transaction.JudyHi - you may want to talk to the title company - but, one idea might be to actually create a loan document that can be recorded as a second mortgage on the house. So, there would be a lien recorded in the event the house is sold or title changes. Just a thought...you're smart, you are! Definately get an agreement written out before you do anything - you need to protect your interest! One just never knows! Best of luck...Nancy
To: CREI-Alliance@yahoogroups. com
From: fxstrider@yahoo.com
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2008 19:12:26 -0800
Subject: [CREI-Alliance] seeking advise on protecting my down payment
Any advice would be greatly appreciated regarding the kind of document I'll need to prepare to ensure my 50k down payment is best protected.My girlfriend and I will be buying a house together here shortly with my 50k cash down and her and I qualifying for the rest in a loan. My question is, if in the event there is a dissolution or we sell the house, that I receive back my 50k down payment. Next position, sort of speak.What's the best way to protect that if in the event of some future closing and have it be a smooth distribution at the title company. If there were a future sale of this house that I am to get my principal of 50k back.Thank you very much.Larry Stevens Phoenix,AZ
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